Leonard Umunna, a bishop and founder of Bible Life Church (worldwide), on the sidelines of the events to mark his 63rd birthday recently, spoke with ZEBULON AGOMUO, Editor, on the secret of his youthful looks, the trouble with Nigeria, how the country can be rescued from the brinks, among other issues. Excerpts:
It is said that the wine gets better with age; it is evident that this is the case with you. The older you become in age, the younger you look; what is the secret?
The secret is just as God told me that when I get to 50 years I would be younger. I thought that at 50 I would hear God say do this or do that; but what I discovered is that He is making me to be more health-conscious. The things I took for granted before I no longer take for granted. The things I never knew before, I now know them. A man of knowledge increaseth strength. I observed that God led it in my heart to follow scriptures; to follow success where they have been recorded and to do that which is better than what I have done in the past. You see, I have come to learn now that the ways of God is different from the ways of man.
But what you just described now is contrary to the experience of Nigeria. The older it becomes the deeper it goes into the mire of crises. Why is it so?
Well, what we have seen in Nigeria is that the new regime that promises to do better will eventually be worse than its predecessor. They have refused to hear the truth; some of us have been shouting our voice hoarse. I have told you three things principally responsible for this. And two are more important than the third one. The least of the three which also is very significant is the vibration effect of Nigeria, it is not good on leadership; it means like “NIGER”- water- always unstable, struggling to move forward, avoiding hard places. That’s the way water moves. So, they will continue to win by bloodshed, quarrel, trouble, and they will be getting worse and worse. That’s that number on leadership. When it comes to leadership, the Number 18 is not the best. Check other people’s numbers, such as America, Britain, Germany, etc, their numbers are vibrating positively and how I wish Nigeria will get a number like Number 1, which is the same thing as 10, 19, 28- just add 9 on each you get the positive numbers. How I wished we could even get Number 6 or Number 7. Yar’Adua (the late President) was Number 7. I told people to watch what he would do and he tried his best within the short period he was in power. President Muhammadu Buhari is Number 18; the Vice President is Number 17. These Numbers are not so good for leadership; they are good for business and a few other things like that. The next, second in importance, is the constitution. Give a good leader a bad constitution, he may do well, but give a bad leader a good constitution, he will not do well. But if this good leader with bad constitution has many bad people surrounding him, the constitution will even make things worse for him. That is where the number two factor comes in, that is the quality of leadership. So, Nigeria is sitting on a tripod- the number it vibrates; the faulty constitution and bad leaders. With the Number it vibrates, Nigeria will always have wealthy people- not wealthy in integrity to lead, but a system where money rules. You know that where money rules, the best will not come out. Constitutional amendment may not be the solution, it would be better to entirely throw out the constitution and say, ‘Let us give ourselves our own constitution’. In order of importance, if Nigeria must move forward, if Nigeria must make the desired mark there is the need to do something about leadership; next the constitution and then change the name Nigeria. There is a need for name change. Some other countries have known this secret and they have since changed their names and moved on.
It is said that life expectancy in Nigeria is between 53 and 56; does it bother you the rate at which people die these days even of common illnesses that are not supposed to claim lives?
It is because of lack of health facilities. God never intended that somebody should die at youth. The life expectancy is so low and will get lower because we are fighting three different forces at the same time. We are fighting economic recession, war and bad leadership that have made nonsense of whatever efforts anybody is making by the sides. We need competent leaders; those who can deliver. If for instance you were a student and no matter the efforts you make, your teacher scores you zero, you cannot make progress, that is exactly what is happening in Nigeria, all our efforts are being made nonsense of by bad leadership. We don’t have competent, visionary, exemplary and leaders that have integrity.
What is your reaction to the alleged planned merger of the CRK and IRK by government, which some have criticized?
These are diversionary moves that will not profit anybody anything. Arguing it till tomorrowwill not solve any problem. The foundation is bad, that’s what they should look into. Somebody who is in primary and cannot write well; in those days if you went to up to Primary 3 or 4 you could write letters; but today even secondary school pupils cannot write letters and some are reporting these days that some of those who went to the university and came out cannot write good letters. It is not about these policies- CRK or IRK. If you like remove it or restructure it, that’s not where the problem is. In our days, the teacher must ensure that you first get handwriting right before they would now put you into vernacular, you begin to pronounce words. In those days, children were not sent to school unless their hands touched their ears over their heads, but it is no longer so; everybody is in a haste. The foundation is wrong. If the child cannot read well, cannot write well and cannot pronounce words, no matter what you do next, he has missed it, he has missed it. The Bible says if the foundation is destroyed what can the righteous do? I say, rebuild it. If they mean that they should teach CRK, IRK, well, it should be at the upper primary because we should not face them early in life with this problem of religion; let their private homes bring them up in their own religion, in their own way so that when they have developed the capacity to accept other things you can now introduce all those things. The Bible says train up a child in the way he should go and when he grows older he will not depart from it. That’s my attitude to it.
Recently, Macron became president of France at 39. What is your suggestion in the area of youth leadership in Nigeria?
We have even tried it; the ones we gave opportunity during the President Obasanjo administration, what happened? Like the older politicians, what they concern themselves with is to become instant millionaires. When they get there they make themselves inaccessible to those who elected them, by surrounding themselves with bodyguards. They go about with a retinue of security guards who scare away people from getting close to them. That’s how the Boko Haram in the north emerged; that’s how militants emerged, etc. When they get there they form a clique, begin to shoot and amass money for themselves. Go to other nations and see how leaders behave. If you like, bring the youngest of all Nigerians; the time of Yakubu Gowon is no longer the time we are in now. We must change our orientation. You see, this APC government is trying but the promises they made which they are not fulfilling is what is making people to take whatever thing they are saying now with a pinch of salt. It is a question of believability. You say you are not persecuting your political opponents but any one that crosses from the PDP to APC is protected; what do you call that? Can people take you seriously? You have reduced the party to one; there are no two parties. You persecute those who don’t want to join the mainstream. My advice is that the fathers at the helm of affairs must show a good example for the children to emulate.
What is your take on the Kaduna declaration- the quit notice given to the Igbo by the Arewa youths?
We have had more than the Kaduna declaration. Ojukwu made the Ahiara Declaration, but what became of it? I have told you severally that the name Nigeria vibrates winning by war or what we may call survival of the fittest; winner takes it all. So, we will continue to have declarations whether by the Niger Delta militants, or the Arewa Youths or by the IPOB/MASSOB or the OPC. All these declarations are just a manifestation of the spirit of ‘you can’t rule over me’. I told you that Nigeria, like an aeroplane, successfully took off at Independence but suddenly came down (crash-landed) and since that time it has not taken off again. The founding fathers tried their best, but somewhere along the line we missed it. They brought in nepotism, tribalism, corruption, etc and the vision and the Nigerian spirit died. We lost focus. The problem is inherent in us. We are not ready to do what others who are succeeding do. But if we can change the constitution so that there’s nothing like state of origin but state of readiness; where do you come from, but of equal opportunities for every citizen, justice and fairness; but if you continue to tell me that there should be no state police; there should be no devolution of power or that we cannot divide, then I would know that there’s something you are hiding that makes you not to relinquish power or that you are cheating on me. They say absolute power corrupts absolutely; in Nigeria we have added ‘fear of losing power corrupts absolutely’. We will continue to have declarations until we start doing things the proper way. We are actually the cause of our problem in Nigeria.
It appears that there is growing spirit of agitation in the country. Every part of the country is agitating for one thing or the other; what do you think is responsible for this?
Injustice and disequilibrium. That is the cause of the problem, unless you redress it, the agitation will continue. Before the Nigeria-Biafra war, we were having regional governments; how much were they giving to the federal purse, about 50 percent; at a point the federal government started giving the states certain percentage (I can’t remember exactly the percentage now), but now agitation made it 13percent, still a wide margin, just on that resources alone. That’s injustice and disequilibrium. They say, he who comes to equity must come with clean hands. There’s marginalisation here and there. And then Buhari came in and decided to give 40 important portfolios to his people, other parts of the country cried out foul, that’s marginalisation. It is evident. I don’t know of any region, state or tribe in Nigeria now that cannot produce a best in an area. Not those days when they said the best footballers were from the East, today, some northerners can play the game better. In those days they used to say the best politicians were from the West, but they abound everywhere now- north, south, west and east. For you to form a kitchen cabinet and feature only your people that they are the only people you trust; this is division. A leader unites his people not divide them. Give other people that sense of belonging and agitation will cease. It is not just about Buhari, it is about APC government. Fairness must be applied in every area, whether in resources sharing, appointment, etc. It is said that perception is all, but in this case it has even gone beyond perception, it is evident now that there is marginalisation here and there.
Since the quit notice was issued by the Arewa Youths, some critics said it was wrong for the Federal Government not to have made any arrest in connection with that threat. What is your view sir?
Nip it in the bud. You can see that we are winning the Boko Haram war now because we have employed more intelligence than the use of force. Those people who have made the declaration have some people backing them. When the Boko Haram war began they said there were some people sponsoring it, and they named some names. You see, why do you leave the root and begin to deal with the fruit only? First cut the root. The problem is internal. Some people say ‘I must rule over you’ or ‘you must not rule over me’. This is a secular state; let there be equity. Whatever the APC is doing now, they should also remember that tomorrow may usher in another dispensation; another party will come in and they will begin to accuse Buhari’s children; Lai Mohammed’s people and the children of other APC chieftains of some things, even the crimes they do not know anything about. They will put them in cell, from there to court and they may be granted bail. Somebody would say no, they are security risk, they should remain in cell. How would the actors of today who are their fathers say feel? You are expanding the injustice. Find out those behind the quit notice and deal with the root. If you go for those sponsoring it, the youths will run away. Prevention is better than cure.
Local government election is coming up soon in Lagos and there’s already crisis over allegation of imposition of candidates and a no-go-area order by some chieftains of the party; what is your take?
Leadership is a dicey matter. I talk of dazzles of power and intricacies of governance. If a leader is not interested in who succeeds him if he is a good leader, the devil may take over, but if he is interested in who succeeds him and becomes selfish and feels that only those in his camp become leaders he also becomes more selfish. This is what is causing these parties to be doing these things. Some even take the candidates to the shrine to swear oath of allegiance and some manipulate the electoral process. If you want the right thing to be done, give the rules and ensure that all those contesting abide by the rules.
There appears to be division at the Presidency. There are activities that portray in-fighting. Have you noticed anything of such?
This problem has been from the onset since the APC government started. We saw it; the President’s kitchen cabinet would be speaking one thing, the EFCC would be speaking another thing; the DSS would be speaking a different thing on the same subject matter. How can a monster with three heads rule human beings? It is not possible. Something is wrong somewhere; it has been on, it is not new. I think that those who drafted the plan, the vision to bring in the APC have been put aside. The ship is rudderless and the machinery has been hijacked. It could even be the plan of certain elements to destabilise the government. You know, when the other time President Buhari travelled, Osinbajo performed very well and was well commended, may be some people are saying let us make the system uncomfortable for him so that it could be said that he is not fit to rule; it is possible. The so-called cabal can do anything. I have talked about the intricacies of governance and dazzles of power.
